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pjtmusic
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 5:59 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

« 24db » wrote:
« pjtmusic » wrote:


Terry Hawke on Harborough FM (UK) does http://www.harboroughfm.co.uk as does Elektroland http://nattefrost.dk/elektroland

OK so they are not Radio 1 with tens or hundreds of thousands of listeners but as the Tesco's adverts say "Every Little Helps"


anybody got a club card? Wink


Special offer this week only:

Buy one EM superstar and get one free Twisted Evil

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24db
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 6:20 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

I'll have a 6 pack of Ulrich Schnauss...currently the new superstar of EM
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pjtmusic
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 6:43 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

« 24db » wrote:
I'll have a 6 pack of Ulrich Schnauss...currently the new superstar of EM


Ulrich Schnauss

Never heard of him, but had a look at his myspace page - bit poppy for my tastes, but not bad music at all.

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24db
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 6:59 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

Not to all tastes, but then again...nothing is.

A Strangely Isolated Place is for me the greatest EM record in a decade...bar none!!

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dlmorley
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:30 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

« pjtmusic » wrote:
« dlmorley » wrote:

Another problem is that media -- especially radio -- have changed considerably over the past ten years. There
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BillBinkelman
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:00 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

I never fail to be depressed/amused/angry at the number of "artists" who cavalierly insult/degrade/show contempt for "other artists" by saying "there sure is a lot of crap out there now"

Who decides what is crap?

It just may be that what you consider to be "art" is just "crap" to them.

Slamming the efforts of others (even if they are misguided and amateurish) only makes those who do it look petty, egocentric and insecure. If their music really is crap, then only people who like crap will buy it and no skin of your noses. And the people who truly value "art" and talent will still notice your contributions. I doubt anyone who buys an album created on a 400 hundred dollar Casio from Best Buy is going to want a sophisticated EM recording that was mixed on a quarter million dollar board or was created using elaborate analogue or digitial synths/modules/sequencers, etc.

The fact is that everyone is having a hard time selling recordings and the sheer number of albums out there is more or less irrelevant. Music lovers will pursue and gobble up good music (good to them, that is) no matter how hard it is to find it, because they are that turned on by it (music). The problem is that music "lovers" are dwindling in numbers and that is the important issue here.

Meanwhile, artists squabble over pieces of a shrinking pie like starved dogs.

Sorry for my bitter attitude, but it's how I feel.

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pjtmusic
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:05 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

« dlmorley » wrote:

Another problem is that media -- especially radio -- have changed considerably over the past ten years. There
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:14 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

No worries! I "usually" agree with Stephen anyway Razz
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 10:28 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

« dronescape » wrote:
« Phrozenlight » wrote:
I am a SUPERSTAR, no one is good as I am, they are just copycats Twisted Evil


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 4:25 am    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

The problem I think is that electronic music is not meant for the masses, and the KEY word is "Masses", EM listeners are more like on higher levels from the pyramid... and always will be...

The more "Comercially-correct" EM becomes... it also descends from the ethereal status it belongs to... not saying that is -bad- , so...

EMBASSADORS (Superstars) would be welcome... It's a mystery how this "Creatures" appear...

...every now and then there will be chances... Sooner or later someone will pop-out... and surely we'll benefit from that... Cool
.

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MarkM
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:17 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

I think the DJ/PA's have added a lot of interest to EM. Even Moby jumped over and did some ambient on is Hotel CD. Perhaps more will follow.
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dlmorley
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:28 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

Well Moby was doing electronic music in the late 80's really...
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:40 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

« BillBinkelman » wrote:
I never fail to be depressed/amused/angry at the number of "artists" who cavalierly insult/degrade/show contempt for "other artists" by saying "there sure is a lot of crap out there now"

Who decides what is crap?

It just may be that what you consider to be "art" is just "crap" to them.

Slamming the efforts of others (even if they are misguided and amateurish) only makes those who do it look petty, egocentric and insecure. If their music really is crap, then only people who like crap will buy it and no skin of your noses. And the people who truly value "art" and talent will still notice your contributions.


If I could produce a big thumbs up smiley it would be right here. Arrow

There is "crap" in all genres. Always has been. It is just more visible (hearable ?) because of the internet.

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dlmorley
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 4:17 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

« BillBinkelman » wrote:
I never fail to be depressed/amused/angry at the number of "artists" who cavalierly insult/degrade/show contempt for "other artists" by saying "there sure is a lot of crap out there now"

Who decides what is crap?

It just may be that what you consider to be "art" is just "crap" to them.

Slamming the efforts of others (even if they are misguided and amateurish) only makes those who do it look petty, egocentric and insecure. If their music really is crap, then only people who like crap will buy it and no skin of your noses. And the people who truly value "art" and talent will still notice your contributions. I doubt anyone who buys an album created on a 400 hundred dollar Casio from Best Buy is going to want a sophisticated EM recording that was mixed on a quarter million dollar board or was created using elaborate analogue or digitial synths/modules/sequencers, etc.

The fact is that everyone is having a hard time selling recordings and the sheer number of albums out there is more or less irrelevant. Music lovers will pursue and gobble up good music (good to them, that is) no matter how hard it is to find it, because they are that turned on by it (music). The problem is that music "lovers" are dwindling in numbers and that is the important issue here.

Meanwhile, artists squabble over pieces of a shrinking pie like starved dogs.

Sorry for my bitter attitude, but it's how I feel.


I have to disagree

Everyone has to decide for themselves what and what isn't crap and as far as I saw, no one was criticising anyone specifically and certainly not "slamming" anyone.

Also, I don't see squabbling. I see a discussion and opinions. I am not worried artistically in any way shape or form by such "music" as far as my career is concerned, but it is totally factual to say that the marketplace is crowded and one big reason for that is the huge quantity of music out there that is made with factory loops from Garageband or Fruityloops and has chord progressions that a 6 year old learns in the first lesson of piano.
I call that Crap. Sorry. others may enjoy it. It's CRAP to me. They are free to make it. I'd rather people do that than go out, get pissed and fight on a Saturday night, but it still remains CRAP and I would say there are FACTS for this statement.
When instrumental electronic music sounds the same, uses the same sounds, the same loops or beats, the same formulas, the same melodies near enough, has no individuality, I call it crap.
Others may love it and for them, that is great, but if we can't say what we PERSONALLY think about music (without being told I should respect everything everyone does) and don't give honest opinions, then it doesn't help anyone.
Telling people their music is "ok" or "nice" when deep down you just want to say "hey, it sounds like 100 other bits of music. try harder, dig deeper, think outside your comfort zone and it may reward you and the listener" is of no use.

So, yes everyone is free to do what they please and this includes criticise music if you have valid reason too and I feel the quality of some "music" these days is so basic and low that there are grounds to call it crap.

And while no one likes being criticised, it is a great learning process to get honest and sometimes vicious criticism. Everyone I know has had some and despite it hurting, there is usually an element of truth in it.

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BillBinkelman
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 4:59 pm    (No subject) Reply with quoteBack to top

Sorry if you thought I was telling you that you can't have an opinion. That's not my intent. However, since I am a journalist and not an artist, my perspective is skewed and relates to a much bigger picture than perhaps you (or anyone else for that matter) may care to take into consideration. After all, while I can HOPE that artists have some altruism about the industry as a whole, it's unrealistic. Art derives from ego, not from altruism, at least from where I sit it does. So, it's somewhat naive on my part to think "Why don't people want to work more for the common good?" and I don't mean "common" as in "high quality Berlin-school EM" but more in "indie musicians who basically record the same kind of music in a broad sense" because, as weird as my perspective may sound to you and everyone else here, from a wholistic approach, there just isn't as much difference between EM and new age and glitch and spacemusic and ambient. It's not that they SOUND the same (duh!) but that the impetus behind them is the same to some degree. But that's an opinion that I can defend in a column or another post.

Anyway, I still disagree with what you're stating in your reply. I don't think labeling something "crap" is anything BUT crap. It's lazy from a journalistic standpoint. Later in your reply you state "you just want to say 'hey, it sounds like 100 other bits of music. try harder, dig deeper, think outside your comfort zone and it may reward you and the listener' which is MUCH more valuable to an artist, much more sensitive, and paints you in a better light as well.

And I completely disagree about the value in what you refer to as "vicious" criticism. Vicious criticism may be entertaining to read (when it's not you who is being criticised) but it's not worth a lot to either a fan or an artist. There's a world of difference between stating an opinion bluntly (e.g. "your music is repetitive, cliche, and it sounds cheaply produced and engineered") versus just ripping someone ("Dude, your music sucks and you have zero talent for playing EM....back to Burger Heaven for you.").

But, hey, as you emphasize, your mileage may vary and far be it from me to squelch opinions. I just find it disheartening to read this since I have read it over and over and over for many years. And, IMO, while everyone has a right to vent, I don't see what the point of it is, i.e. to summarily dismiss the work of others. It's a fairly obvious condition that in all forms of art, there will be 'good" and "bad" works and that public taste is seldom aligned with what the artistic community believes is of value.

Anyway, I do thank you for your honesty, really. Just because we disagree (vehemently) doesn't mean I don't respect your opinion. I just see it differently since my agenda is totally different than yours.

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